mid marks

[ladyvolspvcoach]

Does anyone know the origin of the 4 and 6 stride mid marks? and what are your thoughts on both???

[lonestar]

I first heard about 6 stride "mid" marks from Peter McGinnis while he coached me at Cortland, although we rarely used them. Extensive use of them was brought to my attention by Bubba Sparks, who had shown me Dave Johnston's "The List" or "Six Stride Chart." I first heard about 4 stride marks from a coach who was working alongside Dan Pfaff at University of Texas, and he indicated that Dan felt they were a more accurate tool for assessing stride problems at the end of the run.

[ladyvolspvcoach]

I know a lot of very promenant coaches use the 4 stride mark and a lot of others use the 6 stride mark. I've just never heard anyone discuss the pluses and cons of either. I'm sure there's some very smart coaches who have some knowledge of this topic. I genuinaly do not know...

[lonestar]

Earl Bell uses the 4 stride mark also, despite having been coached by Dave Johnston who feels the 6 stride mark is far superior.

[ladyvolspvcoach]

Does anyone know the origin and rationale behind the 4 stride mids?? I seriously do not know and would like to have that information.

[achtungpv]

Does anyone know the origin and rationale behind the 4 stride mids?? I seriously do not know and would like to have that information.

Dan Pfaff felt that with 6 strides left after the mid there was too much real estate left for something to go wrong that couldn't be interpreted with a mid mark there. He felt at 4 strides he could pinpoint exactly what needed to be corrected since the remaining steps are setting up the take off.

[ladyvolspvcoach]

So the 4 stride mids came after the 6 stride mids were developed! Hmm very interesting. Has anyone done any testing or data collection regarding whether one is better than the other...other than the Hay study?

[achtungpv]

I dunno if Dan invented it but he's given the only explanation I have ever heard for the use of a 4-stride mid.

[lonestar]

I think it's all relative to how many strides you're taking in your approach. I've crunched the numbers on DJ's Six Stride List by subtracting average, penultimate, and takeoff stride lengths from the 6 stride mark (even though I know he hates that! to where I came up with 4 step and even 2 step mids. We would use 2 step mids for 4 and 6 step approaches, 4 step mids for 8 and 10 step approaches, and 6 step mids for 12 steps and beyond. I had a lot of success in developing consistent approaches with my modified chart.

[cdmilton]

Lonestar, I would like to see your modified chart with the 2 and 4 step mids. Can you post a link to the file?

[lonestar]

Lonestar, I would like to see your modified chart with the 2 and 4 step mids. Can you post a link to the file?

DJ would kill me! lol

Don't have a website I can put it up on, but it's an Excel file, so I'll email it to you if you PM me your email address.

[master]

Lonestar sent his Excel file to me to post. You can download the excel file if you want to work with it and see the calculations. If you just want to review the chart, I have modified its presentation a little to post below.

- master

Code: Select all

Bar     Grip    Take    Penult    2       3       4       5     6/Mid
                off     imate
6'6     9'1     5'6     9'4     13'7    17'9    21'10   25'11   30'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
7'0     9'4     5'10    9'9     14'2    18'7    22'7    26'10   31'0
7'6     9'8     6'2     10'3    14'9    19'1    23'5    27'8    32'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
8'0     9'11    6'6     10'8    15'4    19'9    24'2    28'7    33'0
8'6     10'3    6'11    11'2    15'11   20'5    25'0    29'6    34'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
9'0     10'6    7'3     11'7    16'6    21'1    25'9    30'5    35'0
9'6     10'10   7'7     12'1    17'1    21'10   26'6    31'3    36'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
10'0    11'1    7'11    12'6    17'8    22'6    27'4    32'2    37'0
10'6    11'5    8'4     13'0    18'3    23'2    28'1    33'1    38'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
11'0    11'8    8'8     13'5    18'10   23'10   28'11   33'11   39'0
11'6    12'0    9'0     13'11   19'4    24'6    29'8    34'10   40'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
12'0    12'3    9'4     14'4    19'11   25'2    30'5    35'9    41'0
12'6    12'7    9'8     14'9    20'5    25'10   31'3    36'8    42'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
13'0    12'10   10'0    15'3    21'0    26'6    32'0    37'6    43'0
13'6    13'2    10'5    15'8    21'7    27'2    32'10   38'5    44'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
14'0    13'5    10'9    16'2    22'2    27'11   33'7    39'4    45'0
14'6    13'9    11'1    16'7    22'9    28'7    34'4    40'2    46'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
15'0    14'0    11'5    17'1    23'4    29'3    35'2    41'1    47'0
15'6    14'4    11'10   17'6    23'11   29'11   35'11   42'0    48'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
16'0    14'7    12'2    18'0    24'6    30'7    36'9    42'10   49'0
16'6    14'11   12'6    18'5    25'0    31'3    37'6    43'9    50'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
17'0    15'2    12'10   18'11   25'7    31'11   38'3    44'8    51'0
17'6    15'6    13'2    19'5    26'2    32'7    39'1    45'6    52'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
18'0    15'9    13'7    19'10   26'8    33'3    39'10   46'5    53'0
18'6    16'1    13'11   20'4    27'4    33'11   40'8    47'4    54'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
19'0    16'4    14'3    20'9    27'10   34'8    41'5    48'3    55'0
19'6    16'8    14'7    21'3    28'5    35'4    42'2    49'2    56'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------
20'0    16'11   14'11   21'8    29'0    36'0    43'0    50'0    57'0
---------------------------------------------------------------------