Bubka vs Warmerdam

[dafox]

I had an epiphany a few months ago, and finally got around to doing something regarding my (!!) idea.

I ordered '100 Bubka Jumps' DVD from Dave Butler last year. I was watching it one day and about 15min into it I started to zone out. Not really paying attention, but watching. And as I saw the forest from the trees, I realized something... he's doing the same damn thing over and over and over. BUT I've seen this before....where? OH! I know! WARMERDAM does the SAME FREAKING JUMP. So I pulled up video of him and viola!

so, with the magic of video editing software, I present to you Bubka vs Warmerdam:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKfdIDdt67Q
Unfortunately I cant get it to loop forever in the main Youtube window, so I'm going to link this which is probably fullscreen (since we cant embed it here), but this will loop: http://www.youtube.com/v/LKfdIDdt67Q&loop=1

If you'd like to download the actual video, let me know. I can post it.

The bubka vid is from the above mentioned DVD (I suggest buying it from Dave! He's done some great things and its a way to say thank you). The warmerdam clip can be found on numerous videos (including the DVD above). Warmerdam's vid has been flipped (hes not left handed) btw.

[IndyCoach]

this is awesome. thanks

[souleman]

That IS really something. I'm really anxious to see what Altius thinks.

[master]

At Reno this year, David Butler mentioned to me that Petrov attributes several aspects of his model to Warmerdam. I believe David said he learned that while in Formia with Petrov sometime during the past year.

- master

[dafox]

At Reno this year, David Butler mentioned to me that Petrov attributes several aspects of his model to Warmerdam. I believe David said he learned that while in Formia with Petrov sometime during the past year.

- master

yes he did - I have that video of his talk (and am trying to get it uploaded too). in fact, he started his talk with pictures of them side by side

[theczar]

wow....great catch!

[jcoover]

very interesting stuff. the only real difference in the lower half that i can see is that Warmerdam begins to drop his drive knee right at the end of the video. Bubka continues to drive the knee. Any ideas on the reason that Warmerdam would drop it? I'm sure it has something to do with straight-pole technique somehow. really good stuff tho, thanks for the post!

[dafox]

very interesting stuff. the only real difference in the lower half that i can see is that Warmerdam begins to drop his drive knee right at the end of the video. Bubka continues to drive the knee. Any ideas on the reason that Warmerdam would drop it? I'm sure it has something to do with straight-pole technique somehow. really good stuff tho, thanks for the post!

along those lines - does anyone know what petrov/bubka think is a good TO position for straighpoling? be under and hands behind like warmerdam, or be in the air and then hit full flex ala bubka's bendpole technique?

[Bruce Caldwell]

both are pivoting from the hand grip and both are initiating a true swing that transfers energy tot he jump.
very good way to illustrate it
good job

Bruce

[dj]

hey

the knee drop is a result of warmerdam keeping the mass lower on the pendulum swing on the stiff pole... metronome... where as the bending pole allows the mass to penetrate lower without droping the knee...

physics... earl did that on fiberglass because he was holding high and not bending the pole a lot............

one of the points i was going to make about bubka's pole bend was in 1983/84 he was bending the pole 30/31%... a 16' foot grip down to 11'2".. earl and mike was 28%.. 16' grip to 11'6".. bubka was in effect holding higher by just simply bending the pole more.. 4" higher.. tully started maximizing the bend before he went to a bigger pole... earl stayed at around 28%..

another factor was that bubka was "reaching" at the takeoff... the way tim explained what he and joe were doing... in effect giving him a higher takeoff point and greater pole angle... and tully and bell were 3/4" taller!!!

those were some of the changes tully started making in 1983... that helped him jump higher...

dj

[SlickVT]

Interesting you posted this.
I have recently been taking stills from vaulters with different styles and placing "nodes" on different parts of their bodies to see where each of these nodes moves with their different vaulting styles.
It is interesting to see where and how fast nodes move, and in some cases, don't move for extended periods of time during the vault. It is also interesting to see what nodes other nodes are pivoting around at certain times during the vault.
I am going to do my best to do some more work with this, and I will provide more info when I get the chance... possibly not any time soon.

[altius]

"So I pulled up video of him and viola!" Theres that bloody musical instrument again!

Note that I made the point in BTB that Petrov attributed some of his ideas to what he learned from the study of stiff pole vaulters - especially Warmerdam - but also some very good Soviet vaulters of the pre war era.

If anyone is interested i will respond to some of the issues this raises although I have already touched on them in BTB.