Navicular Fractures
vault3rb0y: Thanks for the fresh advice and outlook, that's what Im trying to do. I'll be fine once the depression subsides...ha. Thanks for the prayers too, they're much appreciated.
hallvaulter: I'll have to get back to you on that one. I don't actually know the other 3 ATM, but I'll definitely try to get the info to satisfy your cat-like curiosity. My brother is the person who told me this little tidbit. He's a special forces medic, so I trust his knowledge .
hallvaulter: I'll have to get back to you on that one. I don't actually know the other 3 ATM, but I'll definitely try to get the info to satisfy your cat-like curiosity. My brother is the person who told me this little tidbit. He's a special forces medic, so I trust his knowledge .
"Grip it 'n' rip it"
- bjvando
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As apsully's coach next year, I can't describe how excited we are as a team to add him on to the vault squad. Injury or no injury, we made a commitment to him and will further that commitment.
We, as a track team, wish him the best of luck in his rehabilitation and to a comfortable and positive beginning (next year) at Cal State Fullerton...
keep your head up mr. apsully..
We, as a track team, wish him the best of luck in his rehabilitation and to a comfortable and positive beginning (next year) at Cal State Fullerton...
keep your head up mr. apsully..
Head Coach- Victory Athletics (http://www.victoryathleticspv.com)
Just as an update....
My surgery is scheduled for tomorrow at 5:15 pm. Let the starvation begin, haha.
Anyway, I had my pre-op appointment today and the doc sort of walked me through what he was gonna do. He's either going to use 1 or 2 screws to go through the entire length of the bone, or this other thing called an external fixator. The latter is a device that is connected to a pin on either section of the broken bone and is .... external. After its fitted, the surgeon tightens it up to pull the bones together. He said that, once he "gets in there", he'll decide which method he'll use, but he may end up doing both screws and the fixator.
If there's any interest, I'll try to get some knarly after surgery pics, haha.
My surgery is scheduled for tomorrow at 5:15 pm. Let the starvation begin, haha.
Anyway, I had my pre-op appointment today and the doc sort of walked me through what he was gonna do. He's either going to use 1 or 2 screws to go through the entire length of the bone, or this other thing called an external fixator. The latter is a device that is connected to a pin on either section of the broken bone and is .... external. After its fitted, the surgeon tightens it up to pull the bones together. He said that, once he "gets in there", he'll decide which method he'll use, but he may end up doing both screws and the fixator.
If there's any interest, I'll try to get some knarly after surgery pics, haha.
"Grip it 'n' rip it"
- rainbowgirl28
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apsully wrote:If there's any interest, I'll try to get some knarly after surgery pics, haha.
My sister just had half her thyroid out (she had a weird lump growing on it) and the doctor took pictures of the surgery and of the removed thyroid/lump with her digital camera for her.
It was really disgusting, but I guess some people are into that.
- bvpv07
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PICTURES!!! Woohoo!
Ok, I'm just weird. Actually, I had a pretty decent laceration on my right shin when I was younger...definitely have a few pictures where my leg looks like it belongs to Frankenstein. They gross everyone out, but I think that it's kind of cool.
Ok, I'm just weird. Actually, I had a pretty decent laceration on my right shin when I was younger...definitely have a few pictures where my leg looks like it belongs to Frankenstein. They gross everyone out, but I think that it's kind of cool.
Fly me to the moon
Let me play among the stars
Let me play among the stars
- polevaulter08nw
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Navicular stress fractures
Navicular stress fractures are actually probably more common than most people think. Most involve a stress fracture in the sagittal plane and are not displaced. If the fracture is not displaced, this can be treated in a cast or boot. However, the patient needs to be NON-WEIGHTBEARING FOR 6 - 8 WEEKS. Sometimes, the fracture can go on to displace. However, you'll be able to see it on an x-ray, and an MRI or CT is often not needed. I usually get an MRI to rule out a non-displaced navicular stress fracture not seen on x-rays.
Please be careful about Podiatrists. They are not all good, and most are not good at all. I would seek out an Orthopaedic Surgeon who is fellowship trained in Foot and Ankle surgery.
I did my fellowship with Dr. Roger Mann in Oakland, California who wrote the book on Foot and Ankle Surgery. During my 6 months of post graduate specialized training, I would say that perhaps 25% of the cases we saw were screw-ups from Podiatrists. Unfortunately, in California, Podiatrists are allowed to do anything an orthopedist is licensed to do. This makes it very dangerous at times.
The typical lay person thinks that if he/she has a foot problem he/she should see a Podiatrist. Podiatrists are a dime a dozen.
I am generalizing, but most of this is true. Most podiatrists were medical doctor wannabes who wanted to go to medical school but couldn't get in. They're training is less extensive, and they are not required to do further training to do the surgeries that they often do.
On the otherhand, it is very difficult to get into medical school now. So you are talking about the cream of the crop coming out of college. Then, in order to become an orthopaedic surgeon, you have to be the top in your medical school class. On top of that, in order to get a good fellowship in foot and ankle surgery, one needs to be a top resident in orthopaedics. Most orthopaedists fellowship trained in foot and ankle will have had 4 years of medical school, 5 years of orthopedic residency, and 6 - 12 months of additional fellowship training.
Personally, I did 4 years of medical school, 5 years of orthopedic residency with an additional research year (6 years), 1 year of fellowship training in sports medicine, and an additional 6 months of fellowship training in foot and ankle. To become an expert in my field, it took 15.5 years of my life including undergraduate schooling. That's nearly twice as many years of training than a typical Podiatrist would have.
Now consider that Podiatrists get trained by Podiatrists. Even if the training were as extensive as an orthopedic surgeon, podiatrists aren't trained by the best in the field.
In the pole vault, even if you have vaulted for many years, but never got any good training from a knowledgeable coach, chances are you probably would not be as good a pole vaulter as you could be. Obviously talent plays into being a good pole vaulter as well. A Podiatrist is like being a pole vaulter with limited talent being coached by a low level coach.
Also, I can tell you that in general, Podiatrists will try to push their patients into having surgery. Surgery bills more, and they make more money.
Personally, I would be very careful about having a Podiatrist take care of your foot or ankle problems. I would also be careful about having an orthopedic surgeon not fellowship trained in foot and ankle take care of your foot or ankle problem.
Perhaps there are some good Podiatrists out there. My mentor believed that there were no good Podiatrists out there.
Treating a navicular stress fracture in a cast but allowing weightbearing will not allow the fracture to heal. Moreover, 4 weeks is not enough. If the fracture truly was non-displaced, it would have healed with 6 - 8 weeks of non-weightbearing in a cast.
I have treated several athletes on the University of Hawaii track team with navicular stress fractures very successfully with this protocol. I have not had to do surgery on anyone for a navicular stress fracture.
Most, athletes tend to be very toey in their sprints. Look at their sprint mechanics, as that could also be a source and reason for their pain.
Sincerely,
Spencer Chang, M.D.
Orthopedic Surgeon
Fellowship trained in Sports Medicine
Fellowship trained in Foot and Ankle Surgery
University of Hawaii Pole Vault Coach
Please be careful about Podiatrists. They are not all good, and most are not good at all. I would seek out an Orthopaedic Surgeon who is fellowship trained in Foot and Ankle surgery.
I did my fellowship with Dr. Roger Mann in Oakland, California who wrote the book on Foot and Ankle Surgery. During my 6 months of post graduate specialized training, I would say that perhaps 25% of the cases we saw were screw-ups from Podiatrists. Unfortunately, in California, Podiatrists are allowed to do anything an orthopedist is licensed to do. This makes it very dangerous at times.
The typical lay person thinks that if he/she has a foot problem he/she should see a Podiatrist. Podiatrists are a dime a dozen.
I am generalizing, but most of this is true. Most podiatrists were medical doctor wannabes who wanted to go to medical school but couldn't get in. They're training is less extensive, and they are not required to do further training to do the surgeries that they often do.
On the otherhand, it is very difficult to get into medical school now. So you are talking about the cream of the crop coming out of college. Then, in order to become an orthopaedic surgeon, you have to be the top in your medical school class. On top of that, in order to get a good fellowship in foot and ankle surgery, one needs to be a top resident in orthopaedics. Most orthopaedists fellowship trained in foot and ankle will have had 4 years of medical school, 5 years of orthopedic residency, and 6 - 12 months of additional fellowship training.
Personally, I did 4 years of medical school, 5 years of orthopedic residency with an additional research year (6 years), 1 year of fellowship training in sports medicine, and an additional 6 months of fellowship training in foot and ankle. To become an expert in my field, it took 15.5 years of my life including undergraduate schooling. That's nearly twice as many years of training than a typical Podiatrist would have.
Now consider that Podiatrists get trained by Podiatrists. Even if the training were as extensive as an orthopedic surgeon, podiatrists aren't trained by the best in the field.
In the pole vault, even if you have vaulted for many years, but never got any good training from a knowledgeable coach, chances are you probably would not be as good a pole vaulter as you could be. Obviously talent plays into being a good pole vaulter as well. A Podiatrist is like being a pole vaulter with limited talent being coached by a low level coach.
Also, I can tell you that in general, Podiatrists will try to push their patients into having surgery. Surgery bills more, and they make more money.
Personally, I would be very careful about having a Podiatrist take care of your foot or ankle problems. I would also be careful about having an orthopedic surgeon not fellowship trained in foot and ankle take care of your foot or ankle problem.
Perhaps there are some good Podiatrists out there. My mentor believed that there were no good Podiatrists out there.
Treating a navicular stress fracture in a cast but allowing weightbearing will not allow the fracture to heal. Moreover, 4 weeks is not enough. If the fracture truly was non-displaced, it would have healed with 6 - 8 weeks of non-weightbearing in a cast.
I have treated several athletes on the University of Hawaii track team with navicular stress fractures very successfully with this protocol. I have not had to do surgery on anyone for a navicular stress fracture.
Most, athletes tend to be very toey in their sprints. Look at their sprint mechanics, as that could also be a source and reason for their pain.
Sincerely,
Spencer Chang, M.D.
Orthopedic Surgeon
Fellowship trained in Sports Medicine
Fellowship trained in Foot and Ankle Surgery
University of Hawaii Pole Vault Coach
Check out the video Vault 2000. You may purchase it at SpringCo or On Track.
- rainbowgirl28
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- vault3rb0y
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Wow, Dr. Chang from this post and your information for me at reno (quad strain) I only wish you lived near by to take care of any injury i might have, im very very impressed, and interested in a similiar field- provided i meet all of those qualifications. Anyways, awesome post!
The greater the challenge, the more glorious the triumph
Wow, that was a great post, although I only understood like half of it (vikadin is intense).
Update: First off, my most recent doctor is an orthopaedic surgeon and has numerous certifications in foot/ankle surgery and what not. Luckily, he's definately the real deal.
I guess my sugery took about 2 hours on the table. Afterwords, the surgeon came out and talked to my parents. He said that once he cut me open, he couldn't actually find the fracture, so he guessed where it should be based on my ct scan. Once he had re-broken the bone, he saw something that he'd never seen before. The outside of my bone was healed, but once open, he noticed that it was mostly hollow.
He didn't know what could have caused the above, but said it most likely had something to do with the scar tissue from before. He ended up getting some donor bone material and packing it in there. He said it was very stable, but he went ahead and put in a single screw just for a little extra security.
All in all he said he was extremely happy with the surgery and it wasn't nearly as bad/difficult as he thought it was going to be. My mom said something to him like "he's probably going to be dissappointed that he's not going to have the external fixator on" refering to how frankensteinishly cool it would have been. He replied, "o well, he's going to have about a 3 in long scar". So I guess that's pretty cool, on top of the fact that I have a screw in my foot that is around 2 inches long.
Unfortunately I wasn't able to get pictures yet, but if anybody still wants any I have an appointment on monday to check how its healing. I'll be sure to take a couple then when the doctor takes off the dressing.
-Andy
Update: First off, my most recent doctor is an orthopaedic surgeon and has numerous certifications in foot/ankle surgery and what not. Luckily, he's definately the real deal.
I guess my sugery took about 2 hours on the table. Afterwords, the surgeon came out and talked to my parents. He said that once he cut me open, he couldn't actually find the fracture, so he guessed where it should be based on my ct scan. Once he had re-broken the bone, he saw something that he'd never seen before. The outside of my bone was healed, but once open, he noticed that it was mostly hollow.
He didn't know what could have caused the above, but said it most likely had something to do with the scar tissue from before. He ended up getting some donor bone material and packing it in there. He said it was very stable, but he went ahead and put in a single screw just for a little extra security.
All in all he said he was extremely happy with the surgery and it wasn't nearly as bad/difficult as he thought it was going to be. My mom said something to him like "he's probably going to be dissappointed that he's not going to have the external fixator on" refering to how frankensteinishly cool it would have been. He replied, "o well, he's going to have about a 3 in long scar". So I guess that's pretty cool, on top of the fact that I have a screw in my foot that is around 2 inches long.
Unfortunately I wasn't able to get pictures yet, but if anybody still wants any I have an appointment on monday to check how its healing. I'll be sure to take a couple then when the doctor takes off the dressing.
-Andy
"Grip it 'n' rip it"
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