Bigger poles!

This is a forum to discuss pole vault technique as it relates to intermediate level pole vaulting.
VTechVaulter
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Unread postby VTechVaulter » Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:53 am

Boomer wrote:But I don't agree with just grabbing a pole because it is longer, without knowing exactly what the difference is, and if it will truly make the vault better


maybe you should change your sig then. haha. j/k

i guess this is what i meant to say and its been hit on now. But if you are scared of the next pole, youve already lost.

altius made some strong points in his post, but the one place i have to disagree is that if your not bending the pole at all because your just jumping right over top of your grip, then something has to change to make the pole work efficiently. however if you are getting sufficient bend on the proper pole and not extending much off the top, then yeah, its time to re-evaluate your technique
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Unread postby Boomer » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:17 am

I agree with the jumping over the grip statement, there would be a need to raise grip then.
I should sign, "Grip N' Rip...on the right pole"
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Unread postby vault3rb0y » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:49 pm

When moving up a length in poles, i think of it this way. If you are following the right sequence, literally the ONLY differences in your jump from lets say... a 14'3" 16.3cm flex to a 14'9" 20.8cm flex will be this...

A slightly higher sail piece that you wont feel very much
A little thicker pole.
A slightly stiffer pole... the equivalent of about a 14'3" 15.8cm

This is assuming you are gripping in the same place you do for the previous pole series. If you have moved up to stiffer poles before, going to a longer pole is just as easy. Dont let 6 little inches get in your way of seeing the truth... its just following the sequence to get you jumping high!
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Unread postby jcoover » Sun Dec 17, 2006 7:01 pm

altius,

while my post might have seemed irresponsible and ignorant to you, i really do believe that 'nutting up' has quite a lot to do with pole vaulting in general. not only jumping on big poles, but just vaulting in general. while 'nut up' might not be the right phrase to put into words the emotions that you need to truly be a good vaulter, i believe that in two words, it does a lot. now if you are going to say that it doesnt take at least some courage to vault at a high level, i would call you out. that being said, having some balls and being reckless are two very different things. i had a friend who was a high jumper for poland back in the late seventies and through the eighties. he hung out with bubka sometimes at some of the euro meets and they would talk sometimes. he always tells me that bubka said not to be afraid of a pole. never to be afraid. i think that was what i was getting at in my post. anyways, this high jumper friend of mine would tell me that in my series, its just a series of poles. if you need to go up a pole, you throw the one you have down and pick the next one up and say f*** it. obviously you have to know your series well to do this, but the attitude is to be confident above anything else. obviously, this confidence is there for a reason. to have the confidence necessary, you must know that you have the tools to pick up the next pole. its confidence that you have put in yourself that you are ready to pick up that pole and make that bar. and that is what i meant when i said 'nut up'. sorry i didnt elaborate, but i just wanted to make sure that you dont think that im just some dumb kid who is going to get in a pole vaulting accident on account of recklessness and disregard for the sport.

-Coov
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Unread postby vault3rb0y » Sun Dec 17, 2006 7:51 pm

To me, nutting up is almost always the right thing to do, when under the right guidance. Its the kids who dont HAVE TO nut up because they dont realize that a bigger pole is a potentially more dangerous pole, that end up getting hurt. Usually when you "nut up" you get adrenaline and aggressiveness, that often carries you well through the next pole. If you are timid and not agressive, a number of things can happen, including a late plant or a weak swing... all of which make your chances of getting hurt increase. I say analyze first, but when you know you can make the jump to a different pole, you need to know what you are going to do and how you are going to do it, but dont overanalyze. Just "nut up". :P
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Unread postby altius » Mon Dec 18, 2006 2:21 am

I think "nutting up" is a stupid phrase because it carries the same connotations as "cojones" and can do nothing but convey the wrong idea of pole vaulting.

Confidence comes from technical competence and knowing what you are doing - not from these weird throw away lines which you young guys love but which do not get the job done. I will guarantee you that Bubka never ever thought "I have got to nut it up" when he went up a pole. He knew he was ready because of what had happened in the previous vault. He knew what the conditions were like asnd how they were likely to influence his vault - he knew he was ready - because he was almost always ready. Yes I know all about Barcelona - I was there sitting with his original coach.

The sooner you guys realise that the secret is in a solid technique and not in the notion that you can overcome technical weaknesses by 'nutting up' the sooner you will make significant improvements. If you really think 14'/15/16/17 or even 18 feet is great vaulting for a 17 year old, take a look at the results at the World Juniors. :devil: :yes:
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Unread postby rainbowgirl28 » Mon Dec 18, 2006 2:35 am

altius wrote:If you really think 14'/15/16/17 or even 18 feet is great vaulting for a 17 year old, take a look at the results at the World Juniors. :devil: :yes:


5.50 is a great vault for a 17 year old. Only a handful have jumped that high or better.

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Big poles and confidence...

Unread postby baggettpv » Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:51 am

You need to change equipment when the current equipment doesn't work successfully. Handhold and pole size are the equipment you guys are talking about. Degree of pole bending and depth of landing in the pit are the indicators of the failure of the equipment (success of the training). There are rules out there in regards to pole bend and depth of landing. I have used them since 1983. Anybody know them?

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Altius in the US

Unread postby baggettpv » Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:02 am

Come spend 2 days with Altius at the NW Pole Vault Festival in Oregon City Feb 3rd and 4th. You can have the time to investigate all the questions you have with him in person...and have all the equipment for him to show you. Go to www.willamattestriders.com for entry info.

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Unread postby altius » Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:01 am

OK. 18 was stretching it a bit! But ambitious young vaulters have got to look beyond the next local comp, the next regional meet, the next state meet!! We are in an era of globalisation in every aspect of our lives - you must have a look at what the rest of the world is doing and not be satisfied with being a big fish in a small pond. You wont get there by being macho - but by being extremely competent in everything you do as a vaulter. :idea: :yes:
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Unread postby Tim McMichael » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:45 am

altius wrote:OK. 18 was stretching it a bit! But ambitious young vaulters have got to look beyond the next local comp, the next regional meet, the next state meet!! We are in an era of globalisation in every aspect of our lives - you must have a look at what the rest of the world is doing and not be satisfied with being a big fish in a small pond. You wont get there by being macho - but by being extremely competent in everything you do as a vaulter. :idea: :yes:


No doubt.

I think just looking at local competition limits a lot of athletes. They think they are doing great if they are using a bigger pole than their immediate competitors, even if they weigh 150 and are on a 14' 160. You have to look higher and dream higher or you will never even have a chance to get there

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Unread postby jumpbackin » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:26 pm

In a perfect world you never need to "nut up". You blow through one pole and you've got the next increment to move up to. No need to nut up, you know you can get on the pole that's just slightly stiffer. The problem is most high schools and a lot of colleges have a crappy pole selection. When you're blowing through your pole and the next one up is 10 lbs stiffer, a different brand and has lots of suspect dings all over it, you've got to "nut up" to go at that pole. Bubka didn't have to deal with s*** like that.

Here's to the guy who digs the brown Skypole or the green Catapole out from the depths of the storage shed.


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