40 meter test info

[craigmtb]

Does anyone have any information on the correlation between 40 times and potential height? or standing long jump? either HS or college.

Thanks

[baggettpv]

The faster, the farther the better. After you get the data? Then what plan to go with it.

Rick Baggett

[dj]

hey craigmtb

i'll just throw out a little experience... very small sample.. 5.0-5.1 13-6ish vaulter.. male or female

long jumping should be a much better indicator.. 19 foot vaulters 21”-6ish from 6 steps.

but actually none of these matter if you don't learn the event properly..

i have used the stride rhythms and patterns from my “MID” 6 stride chart for my indicator..

if you can run a “pattern” from the chart that tells me you have the “potential” to jump the indicated height from that “MID”.

The chart simply tells you the run is there… now what do you need to do technically to jump that height.

dj

[baggettpv]

My Masters thesis ('89 - '90) was on a project that took the projected results for a series of tests:
Flying 40
Long Jump
5 alternating bounds distance
Grip Height
Pole Size
Over grip clearance

Then the results were put into a chart in the program that showed the strengths and weakness's of the athlete. The idea was to match the level of each test to a series of training activities that would design a micro-cycle work-out. The really funny thing was that my advisor thought the program would not be useful to the athletic world. What a geek! I still have it as a stand alone program from then. Wow, almost 20 years ago eh. I also had a tutorial on technique learning in hypertext format (if you remember that stuff).

Rick Baggett
WSTC LLC

[KirkB]

RB, nice premise for your thesis!

Why the "5 alternating bounds distance"? Isn't that one a bit redundant with the LJ?

I would have thought you'd try for a gymastics metric and/or a weight-lifting one. Actually, a "clean" would be perfect - it covers both! I wouldn't measure it in pure weight. Instead, measure it in % of body mass.

That should cover it.

I get the LJ, 40, the grip, flex, and pushoff. Those work nicely.

This thread has a lot in common with the "Push off" thread at the moment - where pushoff and grip are being discussed. Maybe "number of video frames on the pole" (before release) might be another one. The less time on the pole, the better!

Kirk

[dj]

Good morning

As a “predictor’ I have not found any test to be as or more reliable than my Six Step “MID” chart.

Can you run the numbers and not jump anything? Yes..

You can run the numbers and not even jump the “average” height on the chart for those numbers. if that is the case, 99% of the time you are ‘stretching’ the steps..

But I will say this.. and not because it is my chart… if you can run the numbers with the correct posture and run technique.. Including a penultimate - long short finish… (not a long and longer last two steps) you WILL jump the height on the chart… if you are taught to pole vault. Guaranteed

The chart pertains to all levels…

In 1995 Tim Mack had a 53-6ish Six Step Mark.. unless he could improve his speed and running technique on the runway enough to hit close to 55 feet.. he was going to have a difficult time being world class. Not “cold hearted” but simple fact.

In the 2004 trials he was at 54-8 with the correct speed and “posture” for that distance and jumped 5.90…



dj

[baggettpv]

Like I said earlier, Data is just data. The process of how to improve that data is the important thing. So if your best mid is only 45 then what procedure's with resultant progressive data will help you get where you want to go.
Surem we would all like to have a proper 55' mid with a grip at 5.05 (or so) but how to get there???

Rick Baggett
WSTC LLC

[dj]

exactly.........

[craigmtb]

Thanks Rick and DJ. It is great to get feedback from such respected coaches.

I was just curious as a predictor. I do run a number of test, and agree that a number of test are necessary to find out where an athlete needs more development. I personally find I get the most info about the athletes potential from the 40 and standing long jump. I have not kept data long enough to have accurate coorelations, and wanted to know if anyone had something they wanted to share.

You're right, potential isn't worth hill of beans if it isn't developed correctly.

[dj]

good morning

i have used both of those, 40 and STLJ, the most.. but i used a 6 step long jump with Tully and Bell.. Both were in the 21'6" range.. from a stand at 42 feet..

but the "chart" gives you a predictor and a training tool.......

dj

[Cooleo111]

When you all mention the 6-step long jump, is that six actual steps or six strides/lefts (with results like 21'6" I assume the latter!)? Also, is the 40m sprint with a standing, falling, or flying start? I've been considering using a flying 30 but I'm not sure how to regulate the "flying part". Any additional info on pre-season testing would be a great help, as this is my first time implementing it! I also plan on testing a standing long and triple jump, vertical jump, pullups, pushups, and a timed rope climb.

Thanks,
Andrew

[dj]

hey

6 steps.. 3 lefts.. 41 foot run... only

dj

ps.. reference..

a 14 foot vaulter should long jump 15 feet from 6 steps

a 12 foot vaulter 13 feet from 6 steps..