Film from my second last high school meet

[GiVaulter09]

Hey just thought I'd post some more video on here just to see what you guys think. This is a vault from my second to last meet of my high school career. Just trying to get a few pointers before I start my college career this year.

Height: 6'
Weight: 175lbs
Pole: 15'6 CarbonFX Weave 185lbs
Grip: 14'7
Bar: 15'
Standards: 80
Run: 6 lefts

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1mOf-RjhQA

(Sorry for not showing the run)

Thanks for any tips!

[KirkB]

Adam,

It's a nice smooth vault, and you clear it effortlessly ... 13 inches over your grip. You make it look easy ... but ...

On takeoff, you're throwing your head back. That's bad ... really bad. I could list a lot of reasons why it's bad, but there's not a single GOOD reason to throw your head back ... that I can think of.

Your trail leg doesn't swing long. Instead, you begin tucking way before you've finished your downswing. Not to be too critical, but I probably shouldn't even call your "swing" a swing. It's more like a tuck immediately after takeoff. Get on the highbar to fix this. You need to straighten out your trail leg, and swing it DOWN (the downswing), before you pass the chord and start tucking. In fact, as you begin to do this right, you'll find less and less need to tuck at all.

You tuck.

You don't swing your trail leg long.

You tuck.

Fix these probs, and you're on your way to 17-0 ... with the SAME grip!

OK, 'nuff said.

On the positive side, you have a nice lead knee drive, and you don't drop your lead knee. That's GOOD! Also, I couldn't see much of your run, but you seem to have a nice head of steam coming into your plant. That's GOOD too!

Not sure, but you could probably jump off the ground better (more quickly/forcefully). You'll have to stop throwing your head back to do that, tho.

I seriously see a 5.20 vault in you for next season ... with good coaching.

Kirk

[GiVaulter09]

Wow, thanks for all the info! Good and bad it will really help. I have been doing a lot of high bar work this year. Just haven't been able to transfer the whole thing to the pole yet. But I'll definitely keep working on it!I definitely agree with you about throwing my head back after take-off. It seemed that it was a bad habit of mine when the bar got higher. It was kinda a mental thing because I didn't think I would get back enough. Do you have any tips on where to look because I've heard look strait ahead and I've heard look at the pole between your hands? I really hope I'm going to get great coaching this year, I'm going to Binghamton with Thompson and Quiller coaching.

Thanks again,
Adam

[KirkB]

There's been some other threads about "throwing your head back" in the past year ... do a search. There's several schools of thought ... and others will chip in here ... but what I suggest is to not even THINK about throwing your head back. It's not the natural action, so it must have started by you forcing it to happen. In a nutshell ... just look forwards.

When you do highbar and rings drills, you don't throw your head back. This arches your back just when you want to hunch it (if that's the opposite of arching). You won't be throwing you head back in the gym, so just get used to how it feels to keep your head in a "natural" position there, then apply that to your vault. Repetition is the key here.

I hope it hasn't gotten so bad that you're subconciously throwing it back. If so, increase your reps in the gym. And just focus on what your legs are doing ... not your head.

Kirk

[GiVaulter09]

Yea I see exactly what your saying. I never throw my head back on the high bar. I'll keep working on it.

Thanks,
Adam

[vault3rb0y]

I think that pole brings some serious heat for you! You can hardly get back in time before it launches you! When you do all this high bar work, apply it with a softer pole but the same grip to feel how when you swing correctly the pole just rolls right over and you end up in line with it very quickly! It's important to work ahead of the pole which you are trying to do, clearly, in the video. But that head thrown back gives the pole a chance to get the "first strike" on you... and after that its going to be hard to catch up with it.

[GiVaulter09]

alright yea i'll do that... my coach just got a couple 14'6 carbon mystic weaves 170,175, and 180... I just got back to training a couple of days ago(vault training that is i've been on a weight program all summer) and off of 5 lefts i went through them pretty fast. But i'll go back down to them so I can try it on a smaller pole. Do you think that one of the reasons that I'm behind the pole(other then throwing my head back) is because I have no trail leg? It seems that a strong whip and down-swing would keep the pole bent for longer and delay the recoil. As well as make me invert faster.

thanks,
Adam

[KirkB]

.... Do you think that one of the reasons that I'm behind the pole(other then throwing my head back) is because I have no trail leg? It seems that a strong whip and down-swing would keep the pole bent for longer and delay the recoil. As well as make me invert faster.

Definitely! You're not putting any energy into the pole at all ... other than the power generated from your run/takeoff ... so that's why you're on light poles, and that's why the pole gets ahead of you. You may not even realize you're doing this, but subconciously, you're tucking too early in an attempt to catch up to the pole. That's the wrong approach, and you need to break yourself of that habit by FORCING yourself to swing with a long trail leg ... every jump. To do this, you need to temporarily get onto some softer poles ... until you get the hang of it.

Then ... a strong whip WILL keep the pole bent for a longer time, which will give you more time to invert. And yes, you WILL invert faster.

But it's not that you want to delay the bend. Rather, you want to stay ahead of the pole (i.e. invert before the pole recoils), and you want to get onto heavier poles. Once you get this LONG trail leg swing going, you'll find your poles feeling softer and softer. That means that when you're putting more energy into them ... due to the power of your downswing. When that happens, the solution is to move up to a heavier pole. But if you find that when you move up a pole you're bending your trail leg too early, you should drop down to a lighter pole again. This balancing of poles to trail leg technique may occur several times in a single training session (up and down ... according to your energy level and weather conditions) ... and several times per season (mostly up ... as your technique improves).

Just remember that your whip WILL delay the bend, but the purpose of a powerful whip is ultimately to get onto heavier poles ... eventually with a higher grip (once your technique has substantially improved) ... and NOT delay the swing/inversion. Stay quick thru all these vault parts.

Kirk

[GiVaulter09]

ok thanks for all the info kirk!

Thanks,
Adam

[GiVaulter09]

Ok so just as a follow up,
I didn't have a whole lot of time to try everything yet but I'm definitely going to keep working on it. I only had one practice before we had our last meet of the summer. Which was only the second practice back for me... I broke it down to 3 lefts on a small pole(13'6 175) gripping at 12'3. I tried to keep my head square at take-off and then swinging long. I found that I would start to swing long and then I would guess at about the cord of the pole I would bring it back up and tuck again. I did see some improvement near the end of practice but I understand that this is going to be a work in progress and will take so time to get right. So I went into the meet with really no pressure to do great and was just gonna have a good time doing the sport I love. I was going off of 6 lefts. Which has been really my approach all outdoor season. So I came in at 13'6 made it no problem first attempt. Then at 14'6 I started to blow through poles. First attempt, I went through a 15' 185lbs gripping at 14'6. Second attempt, went through a 15'6 185lbs same grip. So then it came to the third attempt, and since we really didn't have a pole to go up to I was really forced to increase grip. The next pole we have would have been a 5m 185lbs and that would be a 20lbs jump with a foot higher sail piece. So yea I'm pretty sure that would never happen. Oh and by the way my standards were at 80 for all of these. So for the third attempt I raised my grip to 14'9. I was kinda hesitant with the new grip and was kinda slow at take-off but found a way to squeak over it. So then we went to 15'. This was the first time my coach and I really noticed myself throwing my head back. So first attempt I hit a better take-off mark but still immediately through my head back and didn't really get back enough and just kinda carried through the bar. So we talked about it and decided that I could use a little more grip and needed to hit a better take-off and keep my head square. So I raised my grip to 14'11 really finished take-off well and swung decently. I realized that the pole was a lot softer gripping this high and it felt like an eternity. But I pretty much sat on it and just flagged out. So I went into the third attempt with a little more confidence in knowing what was gonna happen. So I tried to hit the same take-off and swung trying to keep moving on the pole and not sit. And I popped over it pretty easily. 15'6 went pretty well. My second attempt was the closest. I just nicked off on the way up because I didn't get back enough. But by that point the lack of training really set in and my legs were pretty dead.

So like you said earlier that the 15'6 185lbs was bring a lot of "heat" for me. So my question is even though I didn't have a choice was moving up grip and better choice then moving up to a bigger pole? It seems that a bigger pole would just make the problem worse. Although I know that moving up grip does make things harder as well. It just felt like a totally different vault when I was gripping higher. Like I had so much more time. I wish I had film of the competition but I don't. There was a photographer who took a lot of pictures so I'll take a look at those and see if they are any help.

Thanks,
Adam

[KirkB]

... So then it came to the third attempt, and since we really didn't have a pole to go up to I was really forced to increase grip. The next pole we have would have been a 5m 185lbs and that would be a 20lbs jump with a foot higher sail piece.

Adam, nice to hear of your progress. I think you were smart to not use it ... it's too much of a increment all at once. You'll probably need that one early next year tho, if you keep progressing as you did this year!

... Oh and by the way my standards were at 80 for all of these.

... So for the third attempt I raised my grip to 14'9. ... So I raised my grip to 14'11 really finished take-off well and swung decently. I realized that the pole was a lot softer gripping this high and it felt like an eternity. But I pretty much sat on it and just flagged out. So I went into the third attempt with a little more confidence in knowing what was gonna happen. So I tried to hit the same take-off and swung trying to keep moving on the pole and not sit. And I popped over it pretty easily.

... 15'6 went pretty well. My second attempt was the closest. I just nicked off on the way up because I didn't get back enough.

... So my question is even though I didn't have a choice was moving up grip and better choice then moving up to a bigger pole? It seems that a bigger pole would just make the problem worse. Although I know that moving up grip does make things harder as well. It just felt like a totally different vault when I was gripping higher. Like I had so much more time. I wish I had film of the competition but I don't. There was a photographer who took a lot of pictures so I'll take a look at those and see if they are any help.

Adam, as you say, your 14-11 grip will make the whole vault feel slower ... giving you more time to invert. Next year, you'll be gripping even higher than that ... no doubt.

The last meet of the year isn't the time to use a pole 20 pounds heavier than you've ever used, so that was good.

Instead of raising your grip, you could have shortened your run by a couple steps, and then psyched yourself up to accelerate faster than you normally run ... especially the last couple strides. That might have worked better than raising grip, but that's hindsight.

Your 15-0 with a 14-11 grip is only a 9" pushoff. That's not much. Next year, you should strive to get a pushoff of 2-3 feet! In other words, don't be too anxious to raise grip ... even if it's to soften the feel of the pole. Your lack of a decent pushoff is sufficient evidence to me that you still have a long way to go to improve your technique. That's actually a good thing ... that you're already clearing 15-1 and getting close to 15-6 with "poor" technique. It shows that you have lots of upside potential.

Using Brad Walker as an example, in the USATF, he did 5.75 from a short run. His reasons for doing this were different than your dilemma, but he chose to shorten his run rather than to raise his grip. It's a good option when you don't have enough poles in your bag.

You could have done the same, but it's too late to worry about that now. But keep that in mind during next season. Instead of raising your grip, keep getting on heavier poles as your technique improves. The grip-raising will come later. Don't try to raise it too soon, or your technique will suffer.

Don't take these numbers literally, but as a rough guess, I'd say that you should keep your grip no higher than 14-8 until you clear about 16-0. That's a 24" pushoff. After that, you should strive for improving your grip, but NEVER at the expense of reducing your pushoff. For example, to clear 5.00 (16-5), you should grip no higher than 15-0 or so. Keep in mind that these are all rough numbers, and your milage will vary. Just make sure your bars increase as fast ... or faster ... than your grip ... and ALWAYS with at least a 2 foot pushoff.

What are you going to be doing between now and next season? Just curious. Good luck!

Kirk

[GiVaulter09]

Thanks Kirk,
Yea I agree with you, while I was happy that I got 15', I still knew that it was with a 14'11 grip so it wasn't that great. I couldn't even imagine jumping on that 5m pole... So like I said going up a pole wasn't an option. I probably should have went down a left. Is there a rule of thumb that when you go down a left you drop this many poles? Or does it vary from person to person? Well I'm going away to school so once I get there I will be practicing 3 days a week along with a weight room program. The practices will consist of speed and conditioning work. At least I think that is what's going to happen. And then in November we will start to vault again.

Thanks,
Adam