Scholarships

[rainbowgirl28]

Can anyone explain why they did not hire Tim McMichael???

Call and ask Martin <I may not be here long anyway Smith>. I think he really does not want the vault to be successfull ,with Tim it would have been. He wants only walk-ons and to give book scholorships at best. He only offered an 18 foot high schooler 50%. That was an insult. He won the big 12 with the past coach's recruits and athletes.

Supposedly they gave some 11'6" girl 50%.

His policies about the vault have just been all over the place. I don't know how a coach in good conscience can recruit a kid to a program like that and make them any promises about the future of the program.

But if it's really the SCHOOL someone wants to go to, and they would be happy there even without pole vaulting, then more power to them.

[rainbowgirl28]

Can anyone explain why they did not hire Tim McMichael???

Maybe Tim didn't want the job. I don't know that I would want to be involved with those head coaches.

Tim would have taken the job I think if it paid a salary. He ws not offered. When he was with Chip last year he was not getting paid.

Yeah people underestimate the time commitment it takes to coach college, even as a volunteer, and how terrible the pay is. Plus it can really limit the ability of someone like Tim to work with high school athletes.

[bel142]

The past few posts are talking about offering an 18 foot high schooler 50% and thats an insult.... And 11'6" girl High schooler and volunteer coaches... yadda...
As a non-scholarhisp NCAA athlete I am sort of insulted with some of the above commetns.

(to go along with purple vaulter said)

D1 track and field only have what 12.6 scholar ships to offer men and about 18 for women, so a coach's ability to offer more to a female is very reasonable, there is more money to offer, further more different teams have different needs... Why would they commit themselves a student who can only do 1 event. In a championship vaulter is only going to win 10 pts, You get a diesel sprinter that can run the 2, 4, 4x4, they can get up to 40 points in a meet. Same is true with distance and throws. Just because an athlete is good doesn't mean he/she needs or DESERVES a scholarship. Athletics at the college level is more of an opportunity for the student, and by no means is meal ticket. If a team can offer more to a student who really doesn't have the means to go to university then maybe more than 50% is appropriate. Even then a Student- Athlete has some opportunities to negotiate. "Look, School X offered me 60% where you offered me 50%, If you can get me 75% I would much rather to come to you".

Some coach's theories is to spread that amount out, so 10% here and there you can have a much larger pool to give to students. UCLA has 4 or 5 guys jumping 4.90 out of high school who are just want an opportunity to be on the team. Many people from my area have suggested that Vtech doesn't even offer scholar ships to their freshmen vault students because they have a method to get their team to jump high regardless.

Furthermore, the recruiting process only allows for so much face time with the coach and athlete, if a school commits 100% to an athlete and it turns out he is a head case, or not willing to listen, or just a bad guy with no work ethic, the school really has put them selves in a bad position. For some coaches adding 10-20% a year with confrence points makes more sense. Student Athletes have opportunities to do what normal students can not, and should not be offended by the opportunity to go to university at a discounted rate.

cheers
-bel

[pvdad81]

I think if your the number 1 high school vaulter in the nation and you've won every state and national meet in 2009 that you competed in and one of only a handful of 18' high schoolers in the history of this sport, then yes, you DESERVE a full scholarship somewhere. OU probably was hoping Jack would take books, fees and tuition and just commute since they live in town. Then they could give the other half (room and board) to some out of town kid. OU is a gamble. One we are willing to take because Jonathan really wants to go there. However, I think Jack made the right choice. What other college could he have gone to and be coached by a former world record holder in the vault?

[rainbowgirl28]

I think if your the number 1 high school vaulter in the nation and you've won every state and national meet in 2009 that you competed in and one of only a handful of 18' high schoolers in the history of this sport, then yes, you DESERVE a full scholarship somewhere. OU probably was hoping Jack would take books, fees and tuition and just commute since they live in town. Then they could give the other half (room and board) to some out of town kid. OU is a gamble. One we are willing to take because Jonathan really wants to go there. However, I think Jack made the right choice. What other college could he have gone to and be coached by a former world record holder in the vault?

Agreed. I know scholarships are tight for male track athletes, but Jack is one of the few kids out there who deserves a 100% scholarship straight out of high school, and it is insulting to offer him 50%.

[VaultPurple]

Athletics at the college level is more of an opportunity for the student, and by no means is meal ticket. If a team can offer more to a student who really doesn't have the means to go to university then maybe more than 50% is appropriate.

I could not agree more. We had a Jav thrower transfer out because his father felt he was not getting enough scholarship. He was a 205 thrower in high school and left the team before his first meet of college. Jav is a lot like pole vault in the since you are pretty much stuck doing one event. So the coaches were like your lucky to get anything when that could go to a sprinter who could score 20 points (plus we had a guy throw 215 the coach found from the baseball team he taught to throw that far in under two years). But what really made me mad was this guy came from a very well off family, he drove a fancy sports car, and would never have to worry about finding money to pay for collage. But his dad insisted it just wasn't fair that he was that good and couldn't get any more money. My coach turned to him and told him what wasn't fair was the fact that last year we had someone win a conference championship who also had a full time job and a kid at home that was not on any scholarship when he won.


What im kinda getting at (without trying to offend anyone or making any false accusations) is that pole vaulting is not a cheap sport, you are not going to get to an elite level in high school without having enough money to go to different coaches (unless you were lucky enough to go to a high school with really good coach and pole selection). And for the most part, of the pole vaulters I have seen, they would still go to collage if they were an elite pole vaulter or not. Where in some cases you get a really good sprinter who does not come from the best lifestyle, they may not ever get to go to college if they do not get enough scholarships. (and yes i know this is highly debatable with grants and stuff).

But schools kinda have pull over pole vaulters because pole vaulters like pole vaulting so much. They know they can get away with giving you 10 percent, because if no school offered scholarships for pole vaulting, you would still do it just because you love pole vaulting.

When I walked on at collage I was expecting a pole selection, a legal pit, and hopefully a rubber track... three things I never had at school, and if that was all I got Id be happier than a kid in a candy shop. Finding out that they were giving me shoes, workout cloths, and meal money was just icing on the cake. I honestly think I ended up being one of the luckiest athletes in the nation last year, only being a 13'6 pole vaulter in high school, to end up at a D1 school that was just starting male pole vaulting that year, our top pole vaulter quits, so I end up getting to go to all the meets and travel around the country pole vaulting! I mean I got FREE trips to Texas, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Virginia, and South Carolina! You give me a academic scholarship to any school and Id turn it down in a heart beat to be a walk on at a D1 school. There is no way on earth I could thank my coaches, or pay them back for all of the opportunities they gave me. And I left over the summer knowing that we were getting an awesome recruiting class next year, with national elites in every event, including two 15'6 pole vaulters, so i was told I may not have a spot on the roster next year because of roster caps due to title IX. But if the roster is full the coach is giving me a spot as a student assistant coach (or whatever the official tittle is), and says i can still use the poles and pit to jump when I want to.

I am not In any way saying pole vaulters do not dissever full rides, but it is just not logical from a track and field stand point with limited scholarships. So just remember when you argue over weather a pole vaulter deserves 25 or 100 percent, that you are basically getting PAID to pole vault and be a collage athlete when there are plenty of people out there that would love to do it for free, so you should just be happy that you have the opportunity.




p.s. Becca if I am consider an assistant coach next year I want access to the coaches threads!

[KYLE ELLIS]

Another option for developing oklahoma vaulters is a juco on the border of oklahoma and kansas called cowley college. Coach Mark Phillips who has worked with numerous all-americans and national champions (like spencer frame and jenna blubaugh -sp?) is the coach there. Me and Brabdon Banda both jumped for him and it was a great experience, even though we only had him for one season. Our first year before we had Phillips we had nothing, but now they have an excellent outdoor facility, and coach phillips has an elevated runway he can set up inside, plus he has a ton of poles and knowledge. They give Oklahoma kids near in-state tuition, and when I went there it was pretty cheap. Me and Banda kind of set a trend there as he gets alot of kids out of Oklahoma now.

[vault3rb0y]

All Bel is saying is to look at the facts and not be 'insulted' by a coach offering you less. See it as their loss. Whether or not you deserved it doesnt matter- saying its an insult because you deserve more is insulting to underprevilaged families looking for 50% just to make ends meet, or to vaulters that signed for 15% after winning a national championship because it was the university and the program they were looking for. If it's insulting, ask why they arent offering more, and negociate what needs to happen to get to full if that is your end game.

I dont think any vaulter should start vaulting, or continue vaulting, if they goal in the vault is to get a scholarship. 12.6 scholarships means that there is 1 scholarship if you are lucky, given to an entire program of vaulters. Divide 1 by however many vaulters you have, on average i would say 3-4, and assume that right out of high school you are able to jump into that program, you are looking at 25% for jumping 16' 4.75" on average. That wins nearly every state championship and places in all of them. Vault because vaulting is FUN! Otherwise you'll end up in college with a partial scholarship wondering what you're doing there becacuse you already achieved your goal.

[rainbowgirl28]

I dont think any vaulter should start vaulting, or continue vaulting, if they goal in the vault is to get a scholarship. 12.6 scholarships means that there is 1 scholarship if you are lucky, given to an entire program of vaulters. Divide 1 by however many vaulters you have, on average i would say 3-4, and assume that right out of high school you are able to jump into that program, you are looking at 25% for jumping 16' 4.75" on average. That wins nearly every state championship and places in all of them. Vault because vaulting is FUN! Otherwise you'll end up in college with a partial scholarship wondering what you're doing there becacuse you already achieved your goal.

Also remember that athletic scholarships are only for 1 year, so even if a school gives you a good scholarship out of high school, there's no guarantee that you'll get it each year, or even that you'll still be on the team in 4 years.

[kev44000]

Bottom line is college sports is a business. You have to treet it that way. I have for both of my kids. Both went d-1 with full scholorships. On all recruiting visits we took I ask all coach's have you ever cut back money or dropped a kid, and they all said yes. I think the people insulted with some of the above posts, have never been in my position. I do not care about the 12.6 scholorships. That is the coach's problem. I will do what is best for my family.

[swtvault]

Jon Heath Coached Stacey Manuel to a HS national record at Willmar MN in 2000--I think the height was 13'5. Stacey was only a sophmore at the time and she qualified for the Olympic trials at 15 years old!! Jon also had three girls over 13'0 at MSU Moorehead, with one being Jen Hensel @ 13'9. Derek Brugger ended up jumping 17'1 for Jon @ MSU as well. He has had a real good track record of success at all levels, and knows the vault really well. I think OU is lucky to have someone like Jon helping out.

[kev44000]

Jon Heath Coached Stacey Manuel to a HS national record at Willmar MN in 2000--I think the height was 13'5. Stacey was only a sophmore at the time and she qualified for the Olympic trials at 15 years old!! Jon also had three girls over 13'0 at MSU Moorehead, with one being Jen Hensel @ 13'9. Derek Brugger ended up jumping 17'1 for Jon @ MSU as well. He has had a real good track record of success at all levels, and knows the vault really well. I think OU is lucky to have someone like Jon helping out.

I agree. I hope OU has a great vault program again. I am glad to see a vault coach there. The new coach will have to take 15 foot kids and make them better. OU will never offer much to a vaulter, I was told that by the head coach.