Vaulting Weight

[dj]

good morning

Split....was that "little" improvement in vaulting or lifting and do you feel the lack of improvement was from your strength and weight lifting? or lack thereof?

the sign of good coaching and good training is to prioritize "weaknesses"........ what needs to be addressed first.. of course you need strength for all fazes of the technique. but if your run and pole carry are technically "off" more strength will not help.. if your plant is off strength doesn't help with the swing... etc.. etc..

I have found that if an athlete is within the ranges i created (body weight to height) with my formula they will have the basic “strength to body weight” for their age. Unless of course they are a complete couch potato!

I’m not saying not to try and improve.. but base it on priorities…

dj

[Split]

dj, I was in football last year, and had freakish strength for someone of my size. This led to me often forcing the pole to bend, which put me in some bad situations at times. As I got "weaker" through the year, the pole bent less and less, but my technique got better. At the end of the year, the pole was starting to bend again, but this time I believe it was due to improvement of technique. I didnt emphasize on lifting much this summer, so I didn't make the same lifting improvement that I made last year, and haven't been able to touch a pole since April, due to a torn quad.

[dj]

good morning

sounds like your strength to weight is just fine... if you train and eat correctly (proper diet) your weight should migrate to where it should be.

dj

[WarHawkVaulter]

okay after reading all of this i feel the need to ask. how do i add up?

weight- 153(pre season testing)
height- 5'8"

the beginning of the season we tested.
bench- 165
squat- 225
clean- 165

after 5 weeks of lifting (explosive lifting, college program, that i had never been exposed to because all i did in highschool was squat, bench, clean and aux.)
bench- 175
squat- 265
clean- 180
after these 5 weeks i gained 5 pounds, obviously muscle in my legs.

i want to know if i am on a good program, is this beneficial to me?

[dj]

good morning

it seems you are in good shape physically and resonably strong... sounds like RUN...PLANT... SWING technique and some highbar work... should be your focus...

come out of the back....get you feet down.... and plant big... better yet check the Petrov Technical Info i posted in the Advanced section and copy what he says from the start of the approach through the plant... then you will be jumping correctly..

dj

[Split]

I decided to continue to add to this discussion...

Summer of '07: 5'8.5" 125 lbs.
Bench: 190
Squat: 205
Clean: 145

Obviously there should be some alarm here with my squat and bench numbers being nearly even. I have some pretty bad knees, so I couldn't squat much. I could deadlift pretty well though, but I can't remember how much it was back then.

I dropped to 121 when track season started, and I was 5'7" (shrunk?)

Fall of '08: 5'7.5" 131
Bench: 175
Squat: 205
Clean: 135
Deadlift: 315

I didn't play football this year, and I haven't lifted since the season ended last year. I trained doing pullups, pushups, giants, etc. Plyometrics, hills. I did little to no weight training. The deadlift stands out to me because I don't know how I got that strong in that area. I also recently sand vaulted my old 5 step from a 3 step. (Holding at the same place, got my hips over it, etc.) And actually got myself inverted that same day. I decided to focus on a strong core this season, mainly on the goal of getting inverted, while doing plyometrics for explosiveness. Upper body was simply because I wanted to look good again.

[marshall]

i feel like i must contribute since my vault weight has become such a key in my improvements over the summer. keep in mind i played linebacker for two years so coming out of track season at an overly bulky 174, it wasn't such a big deal to me. but then i decided i'd go ahead and skip this year of football so the main focus of my workouts this offseason were lose body weight while maintaining muscle mass and functional strength.


after 5 months of training, i lost 16 pounds, and slimmed down to 158 which is amazing for me because i haven't been that light since i was a 9th grader. despite the big drop in weight i still look like i have a good amount of bulk and muscle on me. so here are the stats:

height: 5'9
weight: 158

bench: 200 (don't know the exact number but it should hover around this)
squat: 300+ (never maxed out, but i can easily rep out sets of 225)
clean: 155 (lol)

i have real huge legs, not overly bulky, just naturally big and thick so leg strength and explosiveness has always been something that i excell at. im surprised my power clean is so weak though. haha what's sadder is that my snatch might catch up to my power clean. bout 30 pounds off.

the main focus of my offseason as far as workouts was plyometrics, core, gymnastics, and no more than 2 miles a day running. the results have been great for me so far; i've become much more explosive and faster. i probably cut at least half a second off my hundred time, i have lost no muscle but slimmed down, and it has really helped me in the vault. i haven't moved up a pole length, only weight, and gained 13 inches on my vault. and my plant is still inconsistent, once that is smoothed out, watch out world. =P

[Barto]

A much more applicable concept is POWER to Weight ratio instead of strength to weight ratio.

Good indicators of POWER are:
Vertical Jump
Standing LJ
Cleans from the floor
Snatch from the floor
30m sprints

These numbers will give you a much more accurate view of your optimal power to weight ratio.

A great rule of thumb for an adult male is to be able to snatch 125% of your body weight.

[zmev]

I don't know what my max snatch is, (never maxed it) but here are my stats;

Weight: 170
Height: 5'10''
Bench: 265
Squat: 355
Clean: 242

So my weight (lbs) to height (in) is 2.43, and my clean is 142% of my weight. Now i keep gradually gaining weight, a few pounds a year, but my strength is increasing much more. Just wondering what people think about this, and where the line of too heavy is. I feel like my strength has helped my vaulting.

[powerplant42]

If your strength is 'beating' your size, and you are still fast, why not keep getting bigger? You will probably NOT outgrow every pole out there!

[KirkB]

... Now i keep gradually gaining weight, a few pounds a year, but my strength is increasing much more. Just wondering what people think about this, and where the line of too heavy is. I feel like my strength has helped my vaulting.

At 170 lbs, 5-10, you're getting near your max weight. If you were 180, you'd have to start compromising your PV technique. If I were you, I would start leveling off on the weights (maintenance only), and focus more on gym & running drills.

Your age also affects your optimum weight. Rough numbers ... before 20, you're still growing ... 20-30, you should be able to maintain your optimum weight ... after 30, your metabolism changes, and it's harder to keep the weight off. Unless you're a Hartwig or a Miles, that is.

Here's something psychological to consider - not just for zmev, but for everyone worrying about their weight in general ...

When you're weight lifting, you're in the weight room with a bunch of football players, throwers, and other huge A-framed guys, and you THINK you want a physique like them ... but if you're in the gym, you're comparing yourself to the highbar and ring specialists, and thinking about how THEY do their tricks so well. You begin to start thinking about how well YOU might do if you had a build (strong but light) like them ...

Guess what body type gets you over the higher bars?

Kirk

[Lax PV]

I don't know what my max snatch is, (never maxed it) but here are my stats;

Weight: 170
Height: 5'10''
Bench: 265
Squat: 355
Clean: 242

So my weight (lbs) to height (in) is 2.43, and my clean is 142% of my weight. Now i keep gradually gaining weight, a few pounds a year, but my strength is increasing much more. Just wondering what people think about this, and where the line of too heavy is. I feel like my strength has helped my vaulting.

I think it has a lot to do with how old you are, and how high is "high." A talent HS vaulter is inherantly going to weigh less... I have read about HS guys jumping 17'+ weighing in at 145 pounds--for the most part, those numbers don't add up for college athletes (although I did meet one kid that jumped 520ish his senior year in college and claimed he was 135).

Couple of numbers I put together of a handful of 500-550 guys gave a lbs/in ratio of about 2.42. Then I looked at about 15 different guys ranging from 540 to Bubka. The 540 to 585 range was 2.42 and the 600+ was 2.47. I think the numbers speak for themselves. If you are in the 2.4-2.45 range and an exceptional athlete, you are in good shape. As that athletism drops, I would argue that your number has got to drop also. The take home message is you have to be healthy and at a weight that you can comfortably manage. There are 6m+ guys that range from 2.33 to 2.53. Likewise I ran into 520+ guys that ranged from 2.20 to 2.71! Food for thought... but not set in stone by any means.