Okay Guys, i'm Stummped. Please Help

[joebro391]

So i've been having this problems the past few weeks. My coach tells me that it's because i'm driving into the pit at take-off, opposed to leaping up, with the pole, like a long-jumper would. I don't disagree with this but i feel there may be other variables. I achive a free take-off to a degree and i extend my arms up well but i still get ripped back by the pole.

And even when i did get off the ground, i wasn't in a good position to invert like in previous jumps (watch other videos of my jumps) I'm just getting more and more frustrated and can't figure this out.

Factors that i feel may be contributing to this are:
1. jumping outward instead of upward at take-off.
2. too narrow of a handgrip
3. over-exxageration of chest drive, forcing my legs to swing under my center of gravity, putting me in a bad place to follow though with.

This is me, at the end of July: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Us_uvqj1Ga8&feature=user
(6-left run; 14' 150; 13' grip; weight - 128)

This is how I've been jumping lately: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS4mbUm6XBA&feature=user
(7-left run; 14' 150; 13'3 grip; weight - 129)

Let me know what you guys think. thank you all. -joe

[powerplant42]

I don't think it's any of those things. In fact, I believe you are doing better now. However, you are having trouble with adjusting to your new environment (a FREE TAKE-OFF!), and are compensating for the unfamiliarity by dropping your right leg as soon as you take-off. Your take-off is excellent, and your swing would be too if you didn't drop your leg right away. That's why it feels like you can't 'catch up' with the pole. Dropping that leg slows you down so much. I guarantee you jump 15'6''+ if you can fix this completely, because your vault is so quick and powerful, and everything else looks up to speed. It only feels like you're not jumping 'up' because you feel too much 'in-ness' from dropping the lead leg. You have what I call a 'bouncy' swing. Brad Walker also has a 'bouncy' swing, but for different reasons... Your swing path kind of looks too much like a right angle. I'll be using this term a lot in the future, I'm glad I've got an opportunity to introduce it now.

[sooch90]

Hey, it looks like your overgripping

[joebro391]

wow, thanks powerplant haha. yea, when i saw the footage for the first time i was like "what the!?! where'd the drive-knee go??" haha.

here's a question, do you feel that i'm too relaxed in the shoulder (such as to make my body go limp)?? and that i'm not "rowing" through enough so that my torso stays upright?? (and that would be in addition to also keeping my drive-knee up)

[Ethan]

A few other things to consider as well is is your bottom arm is collapsing at take off (which also might lead to that double swing kinda double jerk in a couple of your vaults), push that arm up swing fast and bring your top arm to your ankles and push the hips up(not dropping them as soon as your in the "L" position) this will help get you that nice push off on the top.
Run looks pretty good just stay mentally tough.

[powerplant42]

THERE IS NO ROW. Never think about pulling during the swing. Don't try to do it. There is a pull, but it is not a row, and it happens pretty naturally with the right take-off and swing.

I also now see that you are not finishing your take-off very well. Really force the runway back as you jump up. The toe should not point at the box as quickly as yours does.

[joebro391]

THERE IS NO ROW. Never think about pulling during the swing. Don't try to do it. There is a pull, but it is not a row, and it happens pretty naturally with the right take-off and swing.

oh, i think you misunderstood me a bit. i know there's no pull, when i said "row" i meant, the force applied by the shoulder-muscles to prevent the bottom arm from collapsing...if that makes any more sense to you haha

here's a question, my high school coach and i sat around today and broke down all the jumps and went through them, frame by frame. he felt that was i was doing (besides the massive dropping of the knee) was very subtle. but he had a thought that perhaps i was jumping too much. as in, i was jumping strait up, instead of up and out and it was killing all of my forward momentum. any thoughts on this????

[powerplant42]

You should try to jump straight up, while trying to add to the system speed. 18 degrees has been shown to be the most prominent take-off angle of elite vaulters. You cannot find out what the problem you're talking about really IS, until you have fixed the problem with your knee... unless that is the function of your problem, and it's not just a mask over the lesser problem. If you believe it is the root problem, I need you describe what you mean a little bit better. I don't totally understand this 'problem' you think you might have with not jumping 'up and out'.

I still think you're just learning to use a free take-off correctly, and are having trouble with the feeling of not being pulled off the ground by the pole.

Re the arm resistance: If you plant and take-off somewhat correctly, the bottom arm should have almost no part to play in the air. Stop worrying about it and fix your knee problem!

[joebro391]

You should try to jump straight up, while trying to add to the system speed. 18 degrees has been shown to be the most prominent take-off angle of elite vaulters. You cannot find out what the problem you're talking about really IS, until you have fixed the problem with your knee... unless that is the function of your problem, and it's not just a mask over the lesser problem. If you believe it is the root problem, I need you describe what you mean a little bit better. I don't totally understand this 'problem' you think you might have with not jumping 'up and out'.

I still think you're just learning to use a free take-off correctly, and are having trouble with the feeling of not being pulled off the ground by the pole.

Re the arm resistance: If you plant and take-off somewhat correctly, the bottom arm should have almost no part to play in the air. Stop worrying about it and fix your knee problem!

aye, no, i agree with you 100% i have to get a few jumps in without dropping the knee, than i can get more specific. in my curret situation, i can only jump, once a week and today was my day...but it stormed so i got rained out )= so i'm either gonna go sunday or tuesday, when it clears up. i'll post new footage as soon as i have it. thanks for all the input man. -Joe

[golfdane]

The second jump on the 2nd video really scares me. It looks just shy of a pole break. It seems, that your takeoff isn't emphasizing pushing the poletip towards vertical (hands are really high, and that's excellent). If you look at your upper hand, it looks as if it is dipping shortly after the toes leaving the ground.

[VaultPurple]

I think ur starting from too far back. Not that you are necissarily "Out", but you subconsciously know the spot you need to take off from, but if you start too far out then you stride the last step trying to hit the last step, which in turn puts ur hips moving inward instead of upward, that is why your hips are moving foward durring the swing instead of allowing you to have a good chest drive. And I also think that since you are striding a little it slows down your run at the last stride and you cant really jump with the pole, you are jumping then coming back down a little which causes you to pull slightly and bend the pole so it does not shoot you into the pit.

my advice, just move in about 6 in and turn ur legs over!

[WarHawkVaulter]

I agree with VaultPurple about your hips coming forward.

I had this same problem last year and its kinda coming back right now. I figured out that I'm trying to swing too early for a 'free takeoff'. You need to stay big and chesty and hold that take off position a little longer before swinging up. Its just a matter of timing that has to be fixed. Also on a free takeoff you want to have a strong, rigid body not a loose one, keep relaxed shoulders but a strong core and position at takeoff.