5.05 bungee from a 5 step

[Polevaulter2012]

vault3rb0y: Thanks I will start thinking about that and trying the stuff you suggested.

[KirkB]

Generally sound advice, 3P0 ... I just want to question you on a couple points you made ...

... pushing [your bottom hand] up toward the standard moves the bend of the pole to the left, and out of the way, which keeps you from blocking and allows you to fully invert more easily.

I do understand your motivation in saying do "something" so that you don't do "the wrong thing". But I think you're going a bit too far in saying that you should intentionally push towards the standard with your bottom arm. In my experience, the movement of the pole to the side as it bends is a NATURAL movement, and anything that you do to interfere with this natural movement ... even tho you might think you're AIDING it ... is fraught with problems. It's not necessary; it's a passive movement with no utility; it MAY misalign you from your direct forwards motion into the pit; and it's the wrong focus. Instead, I recommend that you focus on keeping your body perfectly aligned and square to the bar ... keeping as much of your weight on your top hand as you can handle (as you say) ... and ignore what the pole is doing. It will move to the side regardless ... you don't have to worry about that!

... hit the pole HARD before you allow your body to relax/extend into the C position you are looking for.

This is true ... but it doesn't mean that you shouldn't ALSO be rigid when you're *IN* the C. And I really wouldn't say that you should "relax" to get into the C. Really, you should be tight from TO thru to your downswing ... even tho you're changing your body angle from "aligned" to the "C". Tight whilst moving ... hope that makes sense. The extreme would be if you relax so much that you're a "rag doll" whilst going into the C. You don't want that!

In re-reading this last paragraph, I realize that some of you may think I'm implying that you STAY in the C for more than a split second. You don't. It's just a position that you PASS THRU ... you don't freeze there at all ... not even for a split second!

Kirk

[Polevaulter2012]

vault3rb0y wrote:
... pushing [your bottom hand] up toward the standard moves the bend of the pole to the left, and out of the way, which keeps you from blocking and allows you to fully invert more easily.

I looked at this as to just push my hands towards the sky at take off.

But I think you're going a bit too far in saying that you should intentionally push towards the standard with your bottom arm. In my experience, the movement of the pole to the side as it bends is a NATURAL movement, and anything that you do to interfere with this natural movement ... even tho you might think you're AIDING it ... is fraught with problems.

I agree with this. The pole automatically moves to the left when you swing. I just need to let my shoulders come back farther and whip my trail leg all the way to the top, But I dont do this because i pull with my left arm when i row instead of keeping it straight. Right?

This is true ... but it doesn't mean that you shouldn't ALSO be rigid when you're *IN* the C. And I really wouldn't say that you should "relax" to get into the C. Really, you should be tight from TO thru to your downswing ... even tho you're changing your body angle from "aligned" to the "C". Tight whilst moving ... hope that makes sense.

I also understand this. I feel like I stay rigid pretty well. Its just now getting my shoulders back, Really whiping to the top,not pulling with my left arm while I row and still staying fairly rigid while doing this? I say fairly rigid because you need to relax enough to move smoothly to the top but rigid enough to stay in control. Right?

[KirkB]

OK Scott ... you've sucked me into doing a vid analysis ... but no comment on Robby's ... I only comment on REAL vaults.

Pardon my bluntness ... I'm not pulling any punches ... you're a big boy.

Your takeoff is wierd. You're looking down, and you're blocking out with your bottom arm. You do push UP instead of FORWARDS with it ... which is better than FORWARD blocking ... but that UPWARDS blocking is still slowing down your swing more than you realize. I count 5 frames in the flat-back, but I could be off by one. That's about 4 frames too many! Once you pass thru the flat-back, you Bubka out of it quite nicely ... so I won't even bother discussing that part of your vault ... you already know how to recover from a poor bottom half.

So I think your focus on how to row with your arms is irrevelant. Instead, you should be focusing on a better pre-stretch (C) ... and focusing on a more vigorous downswing and whip. I'm suggesting that you worry more about what your trail leg is doing than what your arms are doing. Relax your bottom arm more ... and get that trail leg whip going ... in unison with your top arm and torso. I'm sure you can do it ... if only you weren't killing your swing by your stiff bottom arm.

You won't be able to do either of these 2 things properly until you relax your bottom arm and drive the chest thru more. That will put you into a better pre-stretch to whip out of. You have the athleticism to do this ... so talk to your coach about it ... then just do it!

No sense on talking about how to row ... you're just doing what you need to do to salvage a non-existent downswing. Once you fix the bottom half, you won't even be asking about your row.

Having said that, I like the way you swing your trail leg long ... albeit too late and too slow.

My last point is in your "freezing" in the C. Not even sure it's a C. More like a "Y" ... with your two arms forming the top of the Y and your trail leg the bottom of it. Yikes! I like your athleticism ... and I even like the way you partially recover from a non-existent swing ... so I think you have far bigger bars ahead of you ... if you can lick those first 2 probs that I mentioned.

This might not be all that easy if your coach LIKES they way you block out. To me, it's too close to a classic tuck/shoot ... as indicative from the 5 frames in the flat-back position. I'm a Petrover ... so if your coach isn't, then just forget about everything I've just told you. You're better off with a live tuck/shoot coach than a cyber Petrov Model coach ... usually.

... I feel like I stay rigid pretty well. Its just now getting my shoulders back, Really whipping to the top, not pulling with my left arm while I row and still staying fairly rigid while doing this? I say fairly rigid because you need to relax enough to move smoothly to the top but rigid enough to stay in control. Right?

Yeh you're rigid ... TOO rigid. Your top arm ... and your torso ... and your trail leg ... all need to be RIGID. Your BOTTOM arm should be relaxed ... to let your chest drive thru ... just a bit ... and then whip back once you hit ... WITHOUT pausing in the C.

Kirk

[KirkB]

I just read the comments from Altius and Tom, so sorry for any duplication of advice. Basically, it's a question of what model you and your coach want to follow.

Kirk

[Polevaulter2012]

Thanks Kirk, I agree with what you said. My coach has actually told me what you have, but you have explained a few things where it clicks. I have been working on my arms coming back and my whip. I just didnt understand how my whip started from the reverse "c", I can visualize how you have said it a little better now. Thanks for doing this. Oh and I am a petrover too.