Pole Problem

[beers1213]

i have the mid mark chart but im under on my mid too, i know i stretch the steps a little bit but i know its improved a lot. ive tryed moving back but i just compensate and stretch more. i just gotta trust it i guess.

[beers1213]

had a meet today, and made 13' new PR!!!! , worked on the steps being good, and i was a lot better, hit my mid about every jump and my take off bout half the time, other times i was about 6 inches under. i definitely have to work on running faster at take off but thats a different topic. i jumped it on a 14' 165 that the other kid had and blew through at 13' 6". so move up grip and back and move the standards back (were at 25 @ 13' make) or move into a 5 with the 14' 165 or go up to the 14' 170???

[rainbowgirl28]

If your takeoff is on or only a little under, and you are blowing through the 14'165 with the standards all the way back, you ought to be able to get on the 14'170 without trouble. Don't change anything when you go up poles, stay relaxed. If you start trying harder, you'll probably run yourself under and have trouble.

[KirkB]

Beers, congrats on the PR! Nice to hear that you're making progress!

Keep working on improving your takeoff point! And RainbowGirl is right ... you might be ready for that 14 170 now if you can hit your takeoff without stretching under! It's a confidence thing. You just need to run/plant/takeoff just as hard on the 170 as the 165. You can do this as soon as you're landing well into the pit on the 165.

I don't know the exact combination of grip and flex that's best for you, but in general, I wouldn't move up the grip on the softer pole, because that's just going to make it even softer ... and screw up the timing of your vault (you'll be bending it too much).

Instead, I would move the standards all the way back (first), and then move up to a stiffer pole (second). But when you first use the heavier pole, keep your grip identical. Once you feel confident at that grip, THEN start increasing your grip ... gradually.

Technique! Technique!

Kirk

[beers1213]

ok well on the 13' make i was holding 13 1 on the 14 165, standards at 25, then i gripped 13 4 and blew through at 13' 6" with standards at 26. this is all from a 6 step. what grip is good for the 14 170?

[rainbowgirl28]

ok well on the 13' make i was holding 13 1 on the 14 165, standards at 25, then i gripped 13 4 and blew through at 13' 6" with standards at 26. this is all from a 6 step. what grip is good for the 14 170?

So your next step should be to move the standards back to 31.5" on the 165. You're not blowing through until you do it with the standards all the way back.

[KirkB]

ok well on the 13' make i was holding 13 1 on the 14 165, standards at 25, then i gripped 13 4 and blew through at 13' 6" with standards at 26. this is all from a 6 step. what grip is good for the 14 170?

As RainbowGirl said, go with standards at 31.5" and whatever grip you think you can use to clear a bar with the 165. That might be your 13-1 or 13-4 grip - your choice. Just pick the grip that you think you can use to best clear the bar ... based on your ACTUAL EXPERIENCE with that grip ... not based on thinking that for every 3" increase in bar height you need to increase your grip some.

Personally, I would always keep the standards at 31.5". If you think you need to move them closer because the pole will be stiffer, then you're already thinking that you're going to change your technique ... which is the wrong way of thinking.

Remember that as your technique improves, your pushoff will improve too. In fact, one good way of improving your technique is not to measure your success in terms of how high the bar is, but instead, measure it in terms of how much of a pushoff you're getting. The more the better. Increases in bar height will continue to come IMMEDIATELY following improvements in pushoff ... but it's seldom that increases in bar height will CONTINUE to come following increases in grip. Yes, you might get a short-term PR, but if you don't have the technique for an improved pushoff, those temporary gains will catch up to you ... and you'll hit a dead-end in your technical improvements.

When you try the 170 for the first time, the idea is to keep everything the same (same technique, same grip, same standards placement), so that the only difference is the flex of the pole. So whether you grip 13-1 or 13-4 on it is again your choice. The only point I can make here is that if you had a successful series of jumps with a 13-1 grip on the 165, and then you had ONE FAILED attempt (where you blew thru) gripping at 13-4, then for sure you don't know what a successful jump with a 13-4 grip feels like yet, so there's no point in keeping that grip on the 170.

I wouldn't go so far as to say you must clear a bar with a certain grip before you use that same grip on a heavier pole ... but you must at least be familiar and comfortable enough with it to KNOW (have confidence in yourself) that you're going to be able to execute "proper technique" with it and at least have a GOOD CHANCE of clearing the bar.

As a rough rule of thumb, I recommend that you err on the conservative side, and go with a lower grip. You could also choose a 13-2 or 13-3 grip. It's just what you feel confident in using. Really, the BIGGEST factor is to just make sure that you jump EXACTLY THE SAME on the bigger pole. Often, a vaulter will panic (because the pole's stiffer) and try to change his/her technique ... sometimes even mid-vault. That's absolutely the wrong way to get onto a heavier pole. So above all, just make sure you don't do that! Instead, DO EVERYTHING THE SAME ... and the only difference should be that you don't blow thru the bar (as much) ... but you still land well into the PLZ.

On the pic below, the PLZ is the rectangle on the top mat with the eagle on it. It's where you should be landing.

PV Pit with PLZ.JPG (18.4 KiB) Viewed 3505 times

Kirk

[beers1213]

wow a lot of info and i cant thank you enough kirk and becca. kirk, i do agree with keeping the standards back and that moving them forward is just to get higher bar height and not to improve technique, and there is so much left for me to improve.. my run mostly. i dont actually have a 14 165 i just keep borrowing it from whoever we jump against but i do have the 14 170. i know what you mean about compensating the jump and like not taking the same jump on a higher up pole because previous attempts on the 170, granted they were like 2 weeks ago, i couldnt do anything on the pole. i have a meet against a weaker team on wednesday that i can get some meet experience with the 14' 170 so im excited for that. thanks a lot for the help guys, im sure ill be back with another question soon. such a complicated sport

thanks again. andy.

[rainbowgirl28]

wow a lot of info and i cant thank you enough kirk and becca. kirk, i do agree with keeping the standards back and that moving them forward is just to get higher bar height and not to improve technique, and there is so much left for me to improve.. my run mostly. i dont actually have a 14 165 i just keep borrowing it from whoever we jump against but i do have the 14 170. i know what you mean about compensating the jump and like not taking the same jump on a higher up pole because previous attempts on the 170, granted they were like 2 weeks ago, i couldnt do anything on the pole. i have a meet against a weaker team on wednesday that i can get some meet experience with the 14' 170 so im excited for that. thanks a lot for the help guys, im sure ill be back with another question soon. such a complicated sport

thanks again. andy.

Only go to the 14'170 if you are blowing through your other pole. Don't come into the meet thinking you have to get on it. Maybe the weather will suck or there will be a big headwind. Just focus on having a good run and getting your plant up tall. If you blow through the smaller pole with the standards all the way back, THEN try the 14'170 and not a moment sooner.