Getting inverted

[ramenvaulter]

Hey guys, I'm having some trouble getting inverted.
I used to get 12ft on a 13ft Spirit, but it became mushy and all I had left to use was a 12ft 140lb pacer.
My coach told me I can get 12ft on the 12ft Pacer if my shoot got better. However, whats happening is my hips are coming to my head, but not over my head. And then if they do come above my head its not fast enough, and no matter how far I move the standards back I would be shooting too late.

Any ideas and/or advice about how I could correct this?

Thanks

[KirkB]

You need a fast downswing to have an upswing that's fast enough to get upside down.

Kirk

[rainbowgirl28]

What size was the 13' pole? Does the 12' pole feel any bigger?

[ramenvaulter]

Only the diameter of the pole feels bigger, otherwise everything else feels very short

[rainbowgirl28]

OK unless you were on a 13'120 or smaller, the 12'140 is probably not any bigger. Please reference this chart: http://www.skyjumpers.com/articles/pvpr ... table.html

If your 13' pole was bending a lot but you were not moving very deep in the pit, just lower your grip on the pole a fist at a time until you are landing deep. That will take care of the mushiness.

If you were bending a lot and landing deep in the pit, I am guessing you are also landing pretty deep in the pit on the 12' pole. You're going to have a tough time jumping 12' on a 12' pole when you are blowing through it. It is possible but not likely for most high school boys unless you are really short and slow. Usually once the technique is good enough for 12' heights, the pole speed is too fast for 12' poles.

13' on a 13' pole is much more doable, I had a boy do that last year.

[ramenvaulter]

I Land pretty deep using either pole but a little bit deeper using the 13ft one.
So its not very likely I'm gonna get 12ft on a 12ft pole.
Any tips on how to get inverted on the 13ft pole then?

[rainbowgirl28]

I Land pretty deep using either pole but a little bit deeper using the 13ft one.
So its not very likely I'm gonna get 12ft on a 12ft pole.
Any tips on how to get inverted on the 13ft pole then?

If they are both too small than you either need a bigger pole or shorter run.

[ramenvaulter]

I was hoping for some basic inversion tips regardless of what pole is being used.
My hips reach my head but don't extend.
Any tips to help me exted to vertical?

[KirkB]

Any tips to help me extend to vertical?

You need a fast downswing to have an upswing that's fast enough to get upside down.

Search for "downswing".

I'm not the only one that uses that term. Well before I started posting on PVP, Master described it quite nicely, in this July 15 2006 "Speed or Strength?" thread http://polevaultpower.com/forum/posting.php?mode=quote&f=37&sid=99397057241d7965c80faf4573a9ef3f&t=17305&p=124193#preview

... I thought you said that the swing does not add any energy to the vault? Am I wrong in that thought?

In the model of vaulting I am trying to learn and perform, the vaulter takes off with a strong drive knee and the take off foot is left back momentarily as the toe comes off the runway. The body has momentum from the run. The top hand takes the load of the pole hitting the back of the box and (even with the pole bending) it does not penetrate as fast as the chest does, resulting in the classic "C" position of the vaulter's body. This is an ideal setup for a powerful whipping swing of the trail leg forward. Or, the vaulter can have a more passive swing, which will still occur naturally because the body still has momentum and the top hand is what is resisting that forward momentum. The difference to me is obvious. The passive swing adds no more energy to the vault where as the active whip swing does add energy to the vault the same way the gymnast adds energy on the "downswing" of his swing to go over the top [of the highbar]. That's all I'm trying to express. Does that make sense?

Kirk

[VaultPurple]

I was hoping for some basic inversion tips regardless of what pole is being used.
My hips reach my head but don't extend.
Any tips to help me exted to vertical?

im taking this to mean you only have the two poles. So in that case that these are the only poles you have and will have no access to any more. If you are blowing through and want to jump higher. You need to find a run where you dont blow through, maybe as short as 3 lefts depending on where you are now, dont know what your at. Then once you are going over a bungey set back at about 30in. You can jump, bend at waiste with your abs and tuck your hips over your head, then as pole un bends, shoot your hips up really hard like you are dead lifting upside down.

This is for this vaulter only under the situation he does not and will not ever have access to any more poles. I am in no way supporting a tuck in shoot method of balling up, but it is true in this situation that if the poles are too small then this method will increase vaulting height. I personaly believe the only way to get inverted properly is with a long strong swing, but that gets you on big poles, so petrov is not what this particular vaulter needs if and only if he does not have access to other poles.

[KirkB]

im taking this to mean you only have the two poles. ... You need to find a run where you dont blow through, maybe as short as 3 lefts depending on where you are now, dont know what your at. ...

This is for this vaulter only under the situation he does not and will not ever have access to any more poles. I am in no way supporting a tuck in shoot method of balling up, but ...

VP, while your intentions are good in trying to help someone "with only 2 poles", I don't think it's good advice to say that you can switch from the Petrov Model to the Tuck and Shoot Model (aka Drive Model) willy-nilly. That's the wrong approach. What next ... you're going to advise him to switch back again, once he decides to buy a new pole? It's not that easy to switch your technique back and forth!

With a short run and a small pole, you can still jump the Petrov way. There's no reason to switch your technique, just because your poles are too soft ... or too hard ... or any other "excuse". There's no excuse for not learning how to vault properly. Once you vault "properly", then you can vault on any pole you have ... hard or soft.

Kirk

[powerplant42]

Instead of tucking and shooting (if your pole is way too small), move in a step or two... That'll slow you down enough so that the pole will be closer to the right size.